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 Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA

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laki_sa_layaw



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PostSubject: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Sat Aug 01, 2009 8:36 am

Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA next month?
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embosed



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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Sat Aug 01, 2009 10:19 am

Im going to ANA world's fair next week. I'm living close by to the LA convention center. The Philippine collector forum will also assemble there so I definitely will attend and will enjoy the rest of the coin convention activities. If you also plan to go, perhaps we can meet each other and introduce more of ourselves.
EWY
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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Sat Aug 01, 2009 2:20 pm

Yes, I will be there next week as well. I am planning to leave from San Jose on Tuesday and stay in Santa Monica. Is the Los Angeles Convention Center close enough from Santa Monica? Where will be the forum and time?
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embosed



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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Sat Aug 01, 2009 3:25 pm

Santa Monica is not so far from LA convention center but the traffic is terrible during the mid day and traveling time will take you about an hour due to traffic congestion.
About the forum and time, I still had to call Ray Czahor about it. He did mention to me the time and venue but I forgot it as well. By the way, can you tell me your name so that I will know who you are in case we will meet at the convention? Thanks.
EWY
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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Sat Aug 01, 2009 11:53 pm

Anyone who are going to the show, please send me your want list so I can bring it the show if I have it. Mostly are in PCGS holder and a few NGC.
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embosed



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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Sun Aug 02, 2009 7:19 am

Here is my want list:
USPI 1903-S peso MS-63 or higher
USPI 1903-P peso MS-62 or higher
USPI 1904-P peso MS-61 or higher
USPI 1905-S peso MS-60 or higher
USPI 1905-S T2 peso MS-60 or higher
USPI 1908-S peso MS-63 or higher
USPI 1909-S peso MS-63 or higher
USPI 1910-S peso MS-60 or higher
USPI 1911-S peso MS-60 or higher
USPI 1912-S peso AU-50 or higher
USPI 1936-M Q-R peso MS-65 or higher
Please let me know if you have these certified items either by PCGS or NGC and we'll negotiate during at the convention.
EWY
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laki_sa_layaw



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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Sun Aug 02, 2009 2:23 pm

embosed wrote:
Here is my want list:
USPI 1903-S peso MS-63 or higher
USPI 1903-P peso MS-62 or higher
USPI 1904-P peso MS-61 or higher
USPI 1905-S peso MS-60 or higher
USPI 1905-S T2 peso MS-60 or higher
USPI 1908-S peso MS-63 or higher
USPI 1909-S peso MS-63 or higher
USPI 1910-S peso MS-60 or higher
USPI 1911-S peso MS-60 or higher
USPI 1912-S peso AU-50 or higher
USPI 1936-M Q-R peso MS-65 or higher
Please let me know if you have these certified items either by PCGS or NGC and we'll negotiate during at the convention.
EWY

Unfortunately I only have 1910-S MS63 in NGC and maybe 1936-M RQ in either MS65 or MS66 in PCGS. I have to check.
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embosed



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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Sun Aug 02, 2009 3:34 pm

Can you provide me a picture scan of the 1910-S and the 1936m R-Q peso in this forum if you find them in your stock inventory? Or you can send it to my email add at yaplengbio@mailcity.com. Thanks.
Eldrich
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laki_sa_layaw



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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Mon Aug 03, 2009 1:58 am

I could not find the 1936M RQ Peso, however here is the image of the 1910S Peso in NGC MS63.

[img][/img]
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embosed



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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Mon Aug 03, 2009 3:42 am

How much do you intend to sell this piece?
EWY
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laki_sa_layaw



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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Mon Aug 03, 2009 4:59 am

embosed wrote:
How much do you intend to sell this piece?
EWY

$550.00
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embosed



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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:41 am

How about $400? Krause catalog and Lyman Allen also suggest at this price. If you agree, I'll buy it then. Thanks.
EWY
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laki_sa_layaw



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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Tue Aug 04, 2009 3:10 pm

I paid $525.00 for it a couple years ago. Since then this semi-key date has gone up in price. As you know Allen's price guide is out dated, especially on key and semi-key date. I think that $550.00 is a bargain price for this better date. If you don't want it, then this will be up for grabs to anyone who is interested and willing to pay my asking price.
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embosed



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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Tue Aug 04, 2009 4:05 pm

Ok. I'll take it. How do we arrange the payments and the shipping? Wednesday will be the first day of ANA world's fair of money. How do we meet then since I don't know your real name. Can you at least provide me your cp number? Here's my number: (818) 649-0255. Thanks.
EWY
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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Tue Aug 04, 2009 4:30 pm

I'll send you PM, right now....
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embosed



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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Tue Aug 04, 2009 11:24 pm

What do you mean by "I'll send you PM right now?
EWY
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laki_sa_layaw



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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Tue Aug 04, 2009 11:32 pm

Check your PM inbox
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embosed



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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Tue Aug 04, 2009 11:44 pm

I just check my inbox just right now. Its empty. Maybe you send it a wrong email add? Here's my correct address: yaplengbio@mailcity.com or eldrichy@yahoo.com. Send it either way and i'll received it for sure.
EWY
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laki_sa_layaw



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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Wed Aug 05, 2009 12:06 am

In this site, click on PM and you should see an inbox then click on it and you will see the private mail from me.
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embosed



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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Wed Aug 05, 2009 1:19 am

Thanks for your PM. I'll call you tomorrow at the convention when I got there. By the way, here is the Philippine Collectors Forum details and agenda of the meeting:
2. Planning for the next Philippine Collectors Forum (PCF) meeting to be held with the ANA Money show in Los Angeles California is continuing. ANA has us in their meeting schedule for 1-5PM on Friday, August 7, 2009 in Room 511C of the Los Angeles Convention Center. We have tentatively confirmed several presenters for this meeting:
1) John Riley: "US/PI Sea Salvage of WWII (Sunken Treasure or Damaged Goods)"
2) Dr. Ken Berger: "The 1941 One Peso Cebu Emergency Circulating Note"
3) Ken Seymore: "Unlisted Varieties of US/PI Coinage
4) Neil Shafer: 1942 Fantasy notes set from the Canlubang Sugar Estate"

If you want to present, please copy Ken Seymore (seymorekf@hotmail.com) as he will be a primary coordinator of this PCF. Also plan on bringing some "unique" item for "Show and Tell" as well as donations for door prizes I cannot attend as my wife has surgery on July 16th with a six week recovery period. There will also be a PCF Collectors table during the whole show so if you attend please stop by. We will be collocated with Howard Daniel's IBNS collectors table so visit and help us out.
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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Thu Aug 06, 2009 1:09 pm

WOW! What a show set-up. I don't even know where to start. I met Eldrich and we chatted for a while. I did not stay that long but I will be back on Friday for the PCGS Registry luncheon and for the US-Phil Collectors Forum.
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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Fri Aug 07, 2009 12:49 am

The Philippine Coin Collector's Forum is run by Ray Czahor, a long time supporter of the PNAS and a specialist dealer in Philippine coins here in the U.S. Ray's a great guy and very well versed in Philippine numismatics. He also has regular mailbid auctions which I'm sure most of you are aware of, which also get posted on his website, Cookie Jar Collectibles. ~ Jim
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embosed



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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Fri Aug 07, 2009 4:06 am

Hi Jim!
Are you also going to the PCF meeting today and tomorrow at the ANA coin fair? If yes, I hope I can meet you there together with Bill and the rest of us.
EWY
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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Fri Aug 07, 2009 4:40 am

I agree, it would be nice if Jim can attend the PCF meeting and also to collaborate with him.
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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Fri Aug 21, 2009 7:43 am

For those who missed the show, here is the summary of the Philippine Collector's Forum(PCF), courtesy of Mr. Ray Czahor.

7th ANNUAL PHILIPPINE COLLECTORS FORUM (PCF)
AT THE ANA WORLDS FAIR OF MONEY LOS ANGELES, CA.,
7 AUGUST 2009

Ken Seymore opened this years meeting stating: our PCF club meets once a year at the ANA Worlds Fair of Money on Friday afternoon with the primary purpose of educating novice and experienced Philippine Collectors alike. We are a self-supporting ANA club through member /attendee donations. We have a free raffle of Philippine coins; stamps, books, albums, and ephemera at the close of our meeting and most attendees always come away with two or three selections for their enjoyment.

Our opening speaker this year was Mr. John Riley. His presentation was entitled: U.S./Philippines Sea Salvage: WWII Sunken Treasure or Damaged Goods?. A summary follows:

Numismatists and historians are able to reasonably place a select group of coins at the scene of one of the most significant struggles of the Second World War ­ at a time when the fates of nations were very much in question.

The blow that crippled U.S. naval and air forces in the Hawaiian Islands on December 7, 1941 occurred again within hours at the major military and port installations in the Philippines. Without naval support from Hawaii or the mainland United States, her defenders literally found themselves trapped. Lingayan Gulf on Luzon, northernmost and heaviest populated island in the territory, was invaded in force by main elements of the Japanese 14th Army on December 22 and the capital at Manila fell within two weeks. Prior to the actual fall of the capital on January 2, 1942, government securities consisting of some 73 tons in gold and silver bullion, 140 tons of silver peso and centavo coins plus millions of paper Treasury notes, bonds and corporate stocks were taken from the Philippine National Treasury buildings and the safe rooms of the Philippine Central Bank to Corregidor Island in Manila Bay by U.S. Army work details. Through
April, 1942 U.S. submarines were able to enter Manila Bay and surface at Corregidor during the hours of darkness to evacuate key government, military and civilian officials from the island; with those same submarines traveled out the bullion and securities and what coinage they could for safekeeping, eventually at the United States Mint in San Francisco. The paper money was recorded and burned on Corregidor, but the problem remained of what to do with the remaining 15,700,000 ($7.85 million U.S.) in silver coins.

With capture now certain, there were no other options left to secure the remaining 115 tons in silver coins: on April 20, the decision was approved by the command staff for U.S. Army Lieutenant General Jonathon Wainwright to dump the boxed coins into Manila Bay itself. Two straight lines connecting known land-marks intersected at the rough, deep water point of Caballo Bay proximate to the barrio of San Jose; it was there for ten nights in late March and early April, 1942 that nearly three thousand boxes, each containing approximately 6000 peso coins were unceremoniously dumped by scattered work crews including many U.S. Navy sailors from the destroyed submarine tender USS Canopus and rescue ship USS Pigeon.

American and Filipino forces on Corregidor Island were finally forced to capitulate to Japanese General Masaharu Homma, commanding the invasion forces, on May 6, 1942.

The submerged silver didn¹t remain a secret for long. Within weeks, many of the same USS Canopus and Pigeon divers who had deposited the coins were now being ordered as Prisoners of War to retrieve them. The depth at which the boxes were dropped and the special deep water diving equipment required were beyond the area capabilities of the Japanese. Only about $2.5 million were officially raised by the diver POW¹s in the course of the next few months, but through clever subterfuge, a significant lesser amount was denied their captors and was smuggled out into the local economy. Storms, strong currents, quick natural wood rot plus damages intentionally inflicted on the boxes by the divers further scattered the pesos in the Bay and the Japanese soon abandoned attempts to raise more of the coins.

Large scale commercial salvaging operations after the War, notably conducted for the Bureau of the Treasury from 1945-48 and still later by the Central Bank of the Philippines through the late 1950¹s, raised some 10,300,000 pesos. With all recovery difficulties considered, final estimates place the unaccounted coins at approximately 2.5 million pesos.

The theory has never been proposed that the Japanese military commemorative medals produced by Zamora were, in fact, sea salvage! John thought it is worth considering. How did General Homma commandeer a whole bag of small-sized Pesos in 1942? Could they have come from the earliest recoveries? Another new suggestion John proposed is that the 22nd Quartermaster Corps commemorative was struck over large-sized 50-centavos U.S./Philippines coins. This particular medal is dated to the ³official² Fall of Manila (on February 11, 1942) which obviously was well before the great dump and
capitulation of Corregidor, but who is to say when exactly the medals were struck? The Homma Medal depicts a Japanese soldier gazing out presumably at Corregidor as if the Island had yet to be overtaken. Again, when exactly was the medal made ­ was it after the initial limited Japanese recovery of the silver?

In their own right, recovered minor silver issues are legitimately rare. These are small coins, arguably less desirable in circulating and collecting circles of the past 60 years, and probably were carried farther with the ocean currents and were harder to pick up off the floor of the bay with the primitive methods used ­ shovels and ³G.I.² garbage cans. No doubt these small coins were in the hoard, though ­ the proof is indelibly etched on the larger coins as they were found, lying one on top of another. (About15 years ago Ray Czahor recalls talking to a soldier who was part of the dumping team, and he remembered seeing cases of 20-centavo coins being dumped.)

What unusual coins were likely found in the silver dump? We know the great majority were small-sized Pesos. The 1936 commemoratives & Wilson Medals were heavily salvaged and most at the time seem to have been set aside. In addition, salvaged 50-centavo 1936M coins are occasionally observed.

In addition to the romance of hidden treasure, these particular coins remain to tell the tale of the desperate early days of World War II. The tale of the salvage was first presented to the public in YANK magazine in November, 1945. PROCEEDINGS, the magazine of the U.S. Naval Institute presented a scholarly summary of the recovery in 1958 and, finally, the story appeared as an adventure in Reader¹s Digest in April, 1959 ­ a version which was later made into a movie in the Philippines (³Pacific Inferno²) in 1985 and starred football great Jim Brown.


Our next speaker was Dr. Kenneth Berger who presented a talk on the ³One Peso Philippine National Bank Emergency Circulating Note of 1941² (henceforth referred to as the 1P Cebu Emergency Circulating Note). His talk consisted of a recap of what was previously published, included additional information, and presented the current status of his research.

Ken first discussed Prof. Julian Jumalon, who was the note¹s designer. He traced Prof. Jumalon¹s involvement in the design and ultimate printing of this note and also mentioned that Prof. Jumalon was involved in the design of other notes for various provinces.
Ken next identified 96 different localities (not overstamps), consisting of 7 provinces, which stamped the notes, extending from 1 July 1942 to 21 August 1942, inclusive. Besides the overstamps, he also mentioned that a few of these notes had handwritten markings.

Based upon his research, Ken made the following conclusions with respect to the 1P Cebu Emergency Circulating Notes:

1) They were possibly the first emergency circulating notes printed in the Philippines during WWII,

2) They saw wide circulation throughout the Visayas and southern Philippines, having been traced to 7 provinces and 96 localities,

3) The majority of the notes with overstamps circulated in Leyte, followed by Surigao,

4) They were overstamped between 1 July and 21 August, 1942,

5) The overstamps occurred mostly in July 1942, and

6) Overstamps even occurred on the first three Sundays of July 1942.
.
Our third speaker was Mr. Ken Seymore presenting on ³ Some Unlisted Varieties of U.S./ PI Coinage².
Ken showed some twelve or so overhead projections of photos of new and exceptional varieties.
Most of these exceptional photos were by courtesy of ag_coins.com. Some of the new varieties were:
A 5 Centavo 1918/7-S/S; 10 Centavo 1938/7-M; 20 Centavo 1915/4-S; 50 Centavo 1917-S/S. Ken noted and presented four more photos of exceptional Philippine varieties, namely the triple punched mintmarks and date numerals. They were the 1 Centavo 1908 S/S/S; 10 Centavo 1944D/D/D: 20 Centavo 192/2/29-M; and the Peso 1909-S/S/S. There was also a photo of a 1 Centavo piece that appeared to have a very small ³S². This has yet to be confirmed by more examples. Ken went on to discuss PCGS¹s elimination of the 1 Centavo 1914-S large ³S² variety from its registry set, as they no longer recognize it. Finally there was an excellent edge photo of a partial collar strike of a 10 Centavo 1945-D. It showed clearly that the figure side was struck from the Hammer die and the eagle side from the Anvil die. Traditionally with but only a few exceptions the Mint struck the Obverse with the hammer dies. The grading services place the obverse side up with label. With Philippine coins they place the figure side up, unless it¹s requested otherwise. They also apply more weight to the obverse side over the reverse in the grading, an important point to consider.

Our final presenter was Mr. Neil Shafer speaking on ³1942 Fantasy Notes Set from the Canlubang Sugar Estate². Neil first heard of the Canlubang Sugar Estate Notes late last year as a rumor through Ray Czahor, then found them being offered by a dealer at the CPMX in March. The set consisted of a mimeographed 1c, 10c, 20c and 50c, uniface, and all dated June 1, 1942. As Neil had an extensive display of Philippine currency of World War II, he thought these would fit in nicely and placed them in one of the cases. They had never been on the numismatic market before; at the time Neil had no reason to suspect their authenticity as they looked pretty much as they should have looked- notes made in haste.

At home Neil did some Internet research and found that from more than one source that the Canlubang name did not come about until 1948, so named by the Jose Yulo family after purchase of the land from the Madrigal family. To me this was conclusive evidence that the notes are indeed nothing but fantasies. The name of this area before 1948 was the Calamba Sugar Estate, established years before by some American investors and businessmen.

A few other examples have shown up in the meantime. Neil purchased a second set at the ANA Convention, and several pieces have been offered on eBay in recent weeks.

Jose Yulo was an outstanding lawyer and statesman, well known for many years. His name is known by collectors of Philippine National Bank issues as it appears on the 1937 issue of 5, 10 and 20 pesos notes from that bank.

Finally we would like to acknowledge and thank Mr. Ray Navera for sharing with us his laptop slide show of his recent trip to the Philippines, showing some of the historic sites there.

Post meeting activities: Five PCF¹s met for dinner at the Pantry restaurant near the convention center for the traditional after the four hour PCF meeting.

The PCF will hold it¹s 8th annual meeting next summer with the ANA World Fair Of Money convention in Boston Ma.
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PostSubject: Re: Anyone here going to ANA World's Fair of Money in LA   Today at 3:47 pm

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